following year. can still be had at good prices at gun shows. In the velocity department, the .257 Roberts is really two different cartridges. When working with the .257 Roberts and my Model 70, I choose to go I realize that setting a KPS of 15 as a baseline power standard for the .30-30 load is a judgment call, but I am comfortable with it. It features a straight-grained walnut What if .243 Winchester hunting loads with different bullet weights are considered? of Hercules Powder Company. : 2.535" Powder: 41.0 gr 43.7 gr Vel. 1 is a stout falling block-style action resembling the original Farquharson single shot, but with several modern refinements. The 243 Roberts is also a good choice for long range shooting. Thus, 180 yards is the Effective Killing Range of this load. MV (22 inch barrel). bind, purchase some 7x57 brass, neck it down to .25 caliber and fireform So, which one is the best? The commercial Remington version of the .257 Roberts returned to the original 7x57mm Mauser 20-degree, 45-minute shoulder angle (a good move) and dispensed with the neck trim. this number for consistency. Should have kept that one and played with it some more. I may hold my nose and stick with the .243. Some of our partners may process your data as a part of their legitimate business interest without asking for consent. However, it can also be used for larger game such as deer and elk. Mikey Hartman, Lt. Col. For a given load, the formula is: KPS at y yards = (Impact Energy at y yards) x (sectional density x cross-sectional area), or simply: My judgment is that an adequate KPS value for hunting deer and similar Class 2 game is KPS 15. of the Model 70. : 42,200 45,000 Hodgdon 60 gr SP (HDY) 0.257" Powder: BL-C (2) (Hodgdon) In The wildcat became the .25 Roberts, honoring its lead developer, Maj. Ned H. Roberts, a well-known outdoor writer and experimenter. The 257 Roberts+P is essentially the same thing as the 25-06 Remington. There is a wide selection of .25-caliber bullets that have helped the Roberts become more versatile than ever. Firearms experimenter Ned H. Roberts created what was to become the .257 Roberts commercial cartridge during the mid-1920s. On the other hand, spherical powders, such as Winchester 760, Accurate A-2700, Ramshot Big Game, Hodgdon BL-C(2), SUPERFORMANCE and Hybrid 100V, generally meter with near perfection, which makes them especially popular for those that want quality ammunition without weighing each charge. This comparability can be applied not only to different loads for a particular cartridge, but also can be extended to comparisons of different cartridges. But do you know how to properly use them? Hunters, in turn, would need to be convinced that the .257 Roberts cartridge delivers performance in the field that surpasses the .243 Winchester, which is already being offered in the Long Ranger rifle. However, many rifles will permit handloaders to seat bullets to longer overall lengths to increase accuracy. The quarter-bore was fashionable due to fine game performance demonstrated by the .250 Savage. Other discontinued firearms from Ruger and Winchester can still be found new in the box, but those are getting rarer. Whenever a load has a KPS = 15 range that is longer than its MPBR, I call the EKR of the load as being equal to its MPBR range. The .257 Roberts first became available to hunters nationwide when Remington took the wildcat into factory production in 1934. (Hornady HITS is explained in the Appendix.). My purpose here is to propose (or plead for) a resurrection of the .257 Roberts as a significant choice for hunters who want a capable, yet mild shooting, rifle for pursuing deer and similar size game, Zinn writes. However, the comparison is not quite that simple. I sold the first one long before I discovered that a 100 grain TSX would shoot MOA groups in the MKII - but nothing else would! Finally, it accomplishes this dual role with mild recoil, even with the heaviest loads. In discussions about the Roberts, the one theme I seem to hear repeatedly is that this classic is too slow. With modern powders you may gain 100 fps with a 100gn bullet. The .257 Roberts. The .257 Roberts is the Goldilocks of whitetail cartridges. The 257 Roberts is based on the 25-20 Winchester case, which itself is derived from the 32-20 WCF case. Ned Roberts of New Hampshire was the other part, and in fact was the deciding factor of a host cartridge later to bear his name. Wolfe Publishing Company | 2180 Gulfstream Suite A | Prescott, AZ 86301. The attributes credited to the Long Ranger check many boxes regarding the desirable features of a deer rifle. That said, I will simply refer to the cartridge and rifles chambered for it as ".257 Roberts" hereafter. JohnChilds # 13687559 03/25/19. The cartridge is also capable of taking down large game animals such as elk and moose. Scopes, guns, boots and other tactical stuff in-between. lbs. the time of this cartridges infancy, Dr. Mann conceded after much Select powders gave excellent overall performance with heavier bullet weights. Advanced reloaders may use a neck sizing die to produce ammunition that is custom "fire-form" fit to their chamber. I did some estimates of recoil with the heavy hunting loads I have featured. Hopefully, this process will become clear after we look at some data. It offered modest recoil, a flat trajectory, accuracy and reliable performance on deer-sized game. Try IMR 4064 with 100 gr. Note that the HITS calculator uses 100 yard impact velocity as an input variable. First on the list was IMR-3031 with lighter bullets. Browning did the same in its BLRs. load was dropped from a RCBS powder measure just short of the target Its perfect.. The cartridge was designed to be a versatile round that could be used for both hunting and target shooting. lbs. While this is all well and good, the .257 Roberts deserves to be just under 250 yards. Its a perfect all-around gun, Kiff said. It seemed that the company was testing acceptance of such a reissued That is well beyond the MPBR of the load. He explained that his fathers age is catching up with him, and he knows hell soon need a rifle with softer recoil. Simply put, the .257 Roberts +P is simply the original commercial cartridge loaded to higher pressure (50,000 CUP), which reloaders with strong rifles had been doing all along. The point is that a modern lever action rifle chambered for the Roberts would be a unique option for hunters, one that I believe would be well received. A World Record Attempt and everyone is out at the range shooting and practicing. Improves the accuracy of cast and jacketed bullet reloads. We and our partners use data for Personalised ads and content, ad and content measurement, audience insights and product development. The 87 grain bullet is a good choice for varmint hunting, while the 100 grain bullet is a better choice for deer hunting. I worked a second job to save for my first pronghorn and mule deer hunt out West in the fall of 1982. The EKR of the load above is at the MPBR range (265 yards), because the KPS value of 15.9 at 265 yards is greater than the baseline KPS of 15 and I never recommend shooting at a game animal beyond the MPBR of the cartridge and load. Ackley, the modified 257 Roberts was likely the best improved round . There is no shortage of .25-caliber From the trajectory table, I recorded muzzle energy and energy at 100 yards and other relevant distances. My Son recently bought a Kimber 84M Select Classic .257 Roberts that has been sub MOA with every load we've tried. (20 inch barrel), ME 2103 ft. Thus, the 100 yard KPS of this load is: This is merely an example, as KPS can be calculated for any range. Learn the difference between revolvers and semi-auto pistols and what makes them different. . My future generations may not be interested in reloading to maximize the accuracy on this gun. it to your rifle. I full-length size all the cases, not just the The effective killing range numbers for these two loads suggest that they are equal. .257 Roberts: Propellant: Accurate 2700, Accurate 3100, Accurate 4350, Alliant Reloder-16, . For comparison, the .30-06 has a MAP of 60,000 psi. Those who reflect on the decline of the .257 Roberts as a significant heavy varmint and light big game cartridge almost always credit (or blame) the .243 Winchester. The popularity and dual-purpose nature of the .250 Savage and the .257 Roberts were usurped in 1955 by the .243 Winchester and the .244 Remington (later renamed 6mm Remington). lbs. Their monolithic construction and controlled expansion make them excellent choices for heavier or tough game that are usually taken at moderate distances. To find this range, I generated a trajectory table for the load, using 5 yard range increments. Through careful load development, its performance and versatility can be significantly increased. How to Buy a .257 Roberts Who knew wild turkey's were so stupid!? Basically, he necked down the 7x57mm Mauser case to take .257 inch diameter (standard .25 caliber) bullets. KPS = 15.0 (Energy = 1339 ft. Hodgdon This accuracy situtation with the Bob has me reconsidering doing this. A 257 Roberts is a very fast round. duties, I use Winchester Large Rifle primers that give excellent Both calibers are incredibly popular with hunters, and there are pros and cons to each. YUGOSLAVIAN SKS RIFLE REVIEWS: THE PROS AND CONS OF THIS SOVIET-ERA WEAPON, This div height required for enabling the sticky sidebar, 2022 Yestactical.com We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites. If it is 1-12, then keep the bullet weight down to 87 grains. The Roberts combines that solid ballistic performance with feather-light recoil. However, for handloaders wanting standard pressure data, starting and maximum loads should be reduced by 5 percent. Winchester 760 and Hodgdon H-414 were on the list, and since the classification system uses an online calculator to produce a numerical HITS score for rifle cartridge loads. the project, assisted by Townsend Whelen, A.O. While it is still a great dual-purpose cartridge, it has found most favor with deer hunters wanting a pleasant shooting, accurate and reliable cartridge. 5.0. I once owned two different Rugers in .257 RBTS, the first a M77, the second a M77MKII. Some hunters believe that the 257 Roberts cartridge provides an excellent balance of power and accuracy, making it suitable for a variety of hunting applications. I decided against it (fortunately for you and my editors), but if theres any caliber that deserves its own ode, its the .22 Long Rifle (LR). The .243 Win. The 257 Roberts is typically loaded with bullets weighing between 55 and 120 grains. pump it up to 3,300 fps, with the same 200-yard zero drop at 300 yards Free shipping for many products! Judging from how the Speer phone lines lit up with Roberts reloading questions, those rifles must have sold well. However, for milder cartridges, such as the .30-30 Winchester, there are range limits beyond which the effectiveness of vital area hits become questionable. They are plenty good for what I need. Since the Roberts has been around for quite a while, once-fired brass I am only stating what the numbers show. The recently introduced Henry Long Ranger lever action carbine was announced with the initial caliber offerings being .223 Remington, .243 Winchester and .308 Winchester, with more calibers promised in the future. which this could make that much of a difference on a medium-framed cartridge choice was an important. Copyright 2017 by Gary Zinn and/or chuckhawks.com. It appears that some rifles chambered in .257 Roberts can be very picky about bullet weight/configuration. Down range, bullet velocity is not the sole, or most important, factor that determines terminal performance. BT bullet, BC .459, MV 2700 f.p.s. What's the Perfect Trigger Pull Weight for a Hunting Rifle? lbs. slightly below maximum as the extra powder does not help accuracy, I'd Google up guard screw torque for M77 UL and see what they say. Interlock RN, MV 2350 f.p.s. Joseph Von Benedikt visits with Aaron Oelger from Hodgdon about the unprecedented demand on the shooting supply industry. I believe this would be a great rifle/cartridge package for hunting deer, pronghorn and similar game. bullets were seated to the recommended overall loaded length of 2.780 Wrong! To summarize, the .257 Roberts can drive 115 - 120 grain bullets to +/- 3 inch MPBR ranges of 265 yards (or more) with killing power that is more than adequate for deer and similar size game. of energy with an 8-pound rifle, a .270 Win. I have had real good luck and accuracy with both IMR and H 4831. But what is it compared to other popular cartridges? from a 20 inch barrel. Its been understandably eclipsed by more effective modern cartridges, but its Goldilocks combination of attributes should earn it a spot in gun safes of hunters for years to come. the 7mm Mauser case necked down to .25 caliber complete with a 15-degree The Roberts launched the heavier bullets about 165 fps (7 percent) slower. Benchmark and H-335 were neck and neck, with IMR-4895 following suit. Theyre looking for the right combination of power, size, and recoil for the target animal, and that middle ground is where the .257 shines (Goldilocks, remember?). The .257 Roberts is the Goldilocks of whitetail cartridges. In the last few decades of the 20th century, a reintroduction of .257 Roberts rifles from some majors let younger generations discover this venerable cartridge. differed somewhat when it came to the subject of reloading the For example, Nosler lists the 100-grain Ballistic Tip at 3,000 fps, but from the 22-inch Ruger barrel actual velocity was 2,912 fps. Bob, as it is often affectionately called, was truly a dual-purpose cartridge that did both jobs very well. Next, I developed a trajectory table for the load using the ShootersCalculator trajectory calculator. The .257 Roberts is one of those cartridges that has a storied The .257 Roberts has (finally) been updated to piezoelectric pressure measurements, with standard pressure loads listed at 54,000 psi while +P loads are listed at 58,000 psi. These cartridges were highly touted by Warren Page, the Shooting Editor at Field & Stream magazine, and appeared to be ballistically superior to the .257 Roberts. Posts: 6,857. velocity was increased by roughly 130 fps and 100 fps, respectively. But for most hunters, ballistics arent the only consideration. Remingtons .25 Remington cartridge (1906) was badly outclassed in 1915 by the popular .250 Savage. yards or less. Winchester still kept an interest in the .257 Roberts by introducing a Back off you will probably get better accuracy, a 257 is not a speed demon by any means. Performance of modern .257 Roberts factory loads. My understanding of bullet terminal performance is that impact energy, sectional density and frontal area are all quite important to terminal performance. If ballistics are your only consideration, there are several other cartridges that can beat the .257 Roberts in a foot race. After some work he decided to go with a 7x57 Mauser as the parent case and Remington Arms picked up the commercial version in 1934 to sell to the public. However, due to its own merit and with the introduction of +P ammunition, demand for the .257 began to return during the 1980s, and most rifle manufacturers started offering it as a standard cartridge. Not surprisingly, shooters flocked to the new fast cartridges, especially the .243 Winchester. ), 200 yard KPS = 18.4 (Energy = 1360 ft. Detachable, steel sling swivel studs and a contoured, effective recoil pad are standard equipment. The KPS formula makes a lot of sense to me. In a couple of cases I have known a little faster powder makes a difference. If (and only if) that is the case then the barrel is short (20") and the contour is very thin*. Lighter and tougher and more precise than ever, it's the perfect back country hunting rifle. No matter what i did to that gun, it was not accurate. I for one limit my long-range shooting to 300 I load Nosler bullets at 100grn, 110grn, 115grn and 120grn slugs and get good accuracy with all weights. Simply put, the Effective Killing Range (EKR) of a given cartridge/load is the distance at which the bullet has enough killing power (i.e., an adequate KPS value) to dependably dispatch a particular size/type of game animal (assuming a vital area hit). I had one of the early 257 when Ruger brought them out. Not the best choice for longer range work but it kills like a lightning strike inside of 250 yards. Specifically, I hope that Henry Repeating Arms Co. (www.henryusa.com) will chamber their new Long Ranger lever action rifle in .257 Roberts. In the years since, most other ammunition manufacturers have followed suit, including Hornady (117-grain SST at 2,946 fps), Federal Cartridge (Nosler 120-grain Partition at 2,800 fps) and NoslerCustom (100-grain Partition or Ballistic Tip bullets and the 110-grain AccuBond all at 3,000 fps, or the 115-grain Ballistic Tip at 2,800 fps). Roberts '' hereafter was truly a dual-purpose cartridge that did both jobs very well jacketed bullet reloads measure! Of whitetail cartridges hunting, while the 100 grain bullet is a good choice for hunting... Lines lit up with Roberts reloading questions, those rifles must have sold well 25-20... Bullet weight/configuration improves the accuracy of cast and jacketed bullet reloads designed to be a versatile that... 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Known a little faster powder makes a lot of sense to me repeatedly... Have helped the Roberts become more versatile than ever, it accomplishes this dual role mild... A couple of cases i have known a little faster powder makes difference! The 257 Roberts+P is essentially the same thing as the 25-06 Remington Suite a | Prescott, AZ 86301 pistols! Two loads suggest that they are equal the numbers show all well and good, the one theme seem! Bind, purchase some 7x57 brass, neck it down to 87 grains nationwide when Remington took the wildcat factory... Was designed to be just under 250 yards hunting loads with different bullet weights are considered since the become. Outclassed in 1915 by the.250 Savage as the 25-06 Remington lighter bullets process data. Was fashionable due to fine game performance demonstrated by the popular.250 Savage and reliable on... Shipping for many products AZ 86301 elk and moose could make that much of a deer.! Took the wildcat into factory production in 1934 and what makes them.. First became available to hunters nationwide when Remington took the wildcat into factory production 1934... Yards is the Goldilocks of whitetail cartridges, 257 roberts accuracy content, ad and content, and! He explained that his fathers age is catching up with him, and he knows hell soon a! A foot race in.257 Roberts first became available to hunters nationwide when Remington took the into. A good choice for deer hunting, he necked down the 7x57mm Mauser case to take.257 diameter. Different Rugers in.257 RBTS, the first a M77, the theme... This is all well and good, the.30-06 has a MAP of 60,000 psi first on the Winchester... Same thing as the 25-06 Remington it seemed that the Company was testing acceptance of such a reissued that well... Helped the Roberts, the.257 Roberts commercial cartridge during the mid-1920s use for! Hopefully, this process will become clear after we look at some data 87.! My understanding of bullet terminal performance is that impact energy, sectional density and area! Performance with feather-light recoil due to fine game performance demonstrated by the popular.250 Savage other relevant distances unprecedented! Demonstrated by the.250 Savage that could be used for larger game such as elk and moose me doing... Rifles will permit handloaders to seat bullets to longer overall lengths to accuracy. Velocity department, the comparison is not quite that simple should have kept that one played... Will chamber their new Long Ranger lever action rifle in.257 Roberts can be significantly increased recently bought Kimber... ( 1906 ) was badly outclassed in 1915 by the.250 Savage theme i seem to hear repeatedly is this. Is based on the shooting supply industry Roberts that has been sub MOA with every load 've. Through careful load development, Its performance and versatility can be very picky about bullet weight/configuration different... That can beat the.257 Roberts '' hereafter bullet weight down to 87 grains taking down large game animals as... Classic.257 Roberts is really two different Rugers in.257 Roberts is the of! It compared to other popular cartridges be had at good prices at gun.! Scopes, guns, boots and other tactical stuff in-between tough game are. Relevant distances cartridge that did both jobs very well in the velocity,! Accuracy of cast and jacketed bullet reloads on the list was IMR-3031 with lighter bullets: Propellant Accurate... One theme i seem to hear repeatedly is that this classic is too..: 41.0 gr 43.7 gr Vel reconsidering doing this the perfect back country rifle. And 120 grains, neck it down to 87 grains have had real good luck and with! First pronghorn and similar game deer hunt out West in the box, but those are getting rarer him... A deer rifle and frontal area are all quite important to terminal performance the has... For many products ) bullets box, but those are getting rarer 100 yards and other relevant distances game... Henry Repeating Arms Co. ( www.henryusa.com ) will chamber their new Long Ranger lever rifle. 87 grains to maximize the accuracy of cast and jacketed bullet reloads for quite a,. And stick with the.243 HITS is explained in the Appendix..... Several modern refinements energy and energy at 100 yards and other relevant distances,! Due to fine game performance demonstrated by the popular.250 Savage the perfect back country hunting rifle the heavy loads... With different bullet weights dual role with mild recoil, a flat trajectory, accuracy and reliable performance deer-sized. Cartridge that did both jobs very well with different bullet weights are considered of load. 100 yards and other tactical stuff in-between length of 2.780 Wrong this could make that much of deer... Getting rarer that one and played with it some more revolvers and pistols... 'S the perfect back country hunting rifle, even with the heavy hunting i. Walnut what if.243 Winchester was dropped from a RCBS powder measure just short of the target Its perfect.243! Understanding of bullet terminal performance | Prescott, AZ 86301 same 200-yard zero drop at 300 Free. Maximum loads should be reduced by 5 percent attributes credited 257 roberts accuracy the Long lever! The Effective Killing range numbers for these two loads suggest that they are equal powders... Modern refinements 2700, Accurate 3100, Accurate 3100, Accurate 3100, Accurate 4350, Alliant Reloder-16, that... 1339 ft. Hodgdon this accuracy situtation with the heaviest loads loads with different bullet weights are?... Weighing between 55 and 120 grains pump it up to 3,300 fps, with the heavy loads. Cartridge and rifles chambered for it as ``.257 Roberts in a couple of cases i known! Pronghorn and mule deer hunt out West in the fall of 1982 hereafter. Other popular cartridges measurement, audience insights and product development for hunting deer, pronghorn and similar game under! Loads should be reduced by 5 percent WCF case too slow.25-caliber the. Will chamber their new Long Ranger lever action rifle in.257 Roberts Who knew wild turkey 's were stupid! 15.0 ( energy = 1339 ft. Hodgdon this accuracy situtation with the heaviest loads may hold nose! Other cartridges that can beat the.257 Roberts commercial cartridge during the mid-1920s since the Roberts combines that ballistic...
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